Unable to confirm quote: "legal: the undoing of God's Law"

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Unable to confirm quote: "legal: the undoing of God's Law"

iamsomedude
Administrator
posted Jan 29, 2016 by Gavilan
"legal: the undoing of God's Law [1893]"

http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uiug.30112107992429;view=1up;seq=380 

http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uiug.30112107992429;view=1up;seq=389 

I have been trying to confirm the above quote and I am coming empty handed. The links above are the first instance of the term law and legal as they first come up. I could not find the term undoing at all in that tome.
[Last edited Jan 29, 2016]

 


some_dude said Jan 29, 2016
I am also working on this, I received the information from another of whom I do trust, so I have no reason to doubt the validity of this .... maybe it has been paraphrased ... there is a university near me that has the hard-copy encyclopedias. I also have contacted others, and shall get this information to you guys asap.
~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.



some_dude said Jan 29, 2016
While searching to confirm the term "legal: the undoing of God's law" I came across this tidbit:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-dBVJOFTVa0U/VquLW2OHVxI/AAAAAAAAABU/t6hu_f_v4RE/s1600/english%2Blaw.jpg


I too went looking and in volume 14 of the 1893 Encyclopedia on pages 353-358 the book references that Laws are really Natural Law and things observable within nature; what God put into place, before man puts his COMMANDS into action and then those COMMANDS become "law" within the Society: commands emanate from superiors to inferiors.

Thus Blackstone' advances to his proper subject, municipal laws, through (1)the laws of inanimate matter, (2) the laws of animal nutrition, digestion, etc ..,(3) the law of nature, which are rules imposed by God men and discoverable by reason alone, and (4) the revealed or Divine law, which is part of the law of nature directly expounded by God. All of these' are connected by this common element that they are "rules of action dictated by some superior being."
~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.



some_dude said Jan 29, 2016


so, I think this "quote" is actually paraphrased, but will still keep looking.
~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.




Ethan Edwin said Jan 29, 2016
There are two ways to look at LEGAL. One is how it applies to CITIZENS:

Blacks Law 4th:

LEGAL. 1. Conforming to the law; according to
law; required or permitted by law; not forbidden
or discountenanced by law; good and effectual
in law. Freeman v. Fowler Packing Co., 135 Kan.
378, 11 P.2d 276, 277; General Motors Acceptance
Corporation v. Schwartz, 118 N.J.L. 25, 190 A. 625,
627.
2. Proper or sufficient to be recognized by the
law; cognizable in the courts; competent or adequate to fulfill the requirements of the law.
3. Cognizable in courts of law, as distinguished
from courts of equity; construed or governed by
the rules and principles of law, in contradistinction
to rules of equity
4. Posited by the courts as the inference or imputation of the law, as a matter of construction,
rather than established by actual proof; e. g., legal
malice.

ILLEGAL. Not authorized by law; illicit; unlawful; contrary to law

LAW. That which is laid down, ordained, or established. A rule or method according to which
phenomena or actions co-exist or follow each other. That which must be obeyed and followed by
citizens, subject to sanctions or legal consequences,
is a "law." Koenig v. Flynn, 258 N.Y. 292, 179 N.
E. 705.
In old English jurisprudence, "law" is used to
signify an oath, or the privilege of being sworn;
as in the, phrases "to wage one's law," "to lose
one's law."
The term is also used in opposition to "fact."
Thus questions of law are to be decided by the
court, while it is the province of the jury to solve
questions of fact.


So, legal is, "conforming to the law". And Law is, "..that which must be obeyed and followed by citizens". And, as has been pointed out, it is a CRIME to PRETEND to be a US Citizen. So, stop pretending to be a citizen of a fiction, a lie, and LEGAL falls away from you.

The other way to see legal is in relation to Cestui Que Vie, here in Bouviers:

LEGAL. That which is according to law. It is used in opposition to equitable, as the legal estate is, in the trustee, the equitable estate in the cestui que trust. Vide Powell on Mortg. Index, h. t.

2. The party who has the legal title, has alone the right to seek a remedy for a wrong to his estate, in a court of law, though he may have no beneficial interest in it. The equitable owner, is he who has not the legal estate, but is entitled to the beneficial interest.

3. The person who holds the legal estate for the benefit of another, is called a trustee; he who has the beneficiary interest and does not hold the legal title, is called the beneficiary, or more technically, the cestui que trust.

4. When the trustee has a claim, he must enforce his right in a court of equity, for he cannot sue any one at law, in his own name; 1 East, 497; 8 T. R. 332; 1 Saund. 158, n. 1; 2 Bing. 20; still less can he in such court sue his own trustee. 1 East, 497.

LEGAL ESTATE. One, the right to which may be enforced in a court of law. It is distinguished from an equitable estate, the rights to which can be established only in a court of equity. 2 Bouv. Inst. n. 1688.

ILLEGAL. Contrary to law; unlawful.

2. It is a general rule, that the law will never give its aid to a party who has entered into an illegal contract, whether the same be in direct violation of a statute, against public policy, or opposed to public morals. .Nor to a contract which is fraudulent, which affects the defendant or a third person.

3. A contract in violation of a statute is absolutely void, and, however disguised, it will be set aside, for no form of expression can remove the substantial defect inherent in the nature of the transaction; the courts will investigate the real object of the contracting parties, and if that be repugnant to the law, it will vitiate the transaction.

4. Contracts against the public policy of the law, are equally void as if they were in violation of a public statute; a contract not to marry any one, is therefore illegal and void. See Void.

5. A contract against the purity of manners is also illegal; as, for example, a agreement to cohabit unlawfully with another, is therefore void; but a bond given for past cohabitation, being considered as remuneration for past injury, is binding. 4 Bouv. Inst. n. 3853.

6. All contracts which have for their object, or which may in their consequences, be injurious to third persons, altogether unconnected with them, are in general illegal and void. Of the first, an example may be found in the case where a sheriff's officer received a sum of money from a defendant for admitting to bail, and agreed to pay the bail, part of the money which was so exacted. 2 Burr. 924. The case of a wager between two persons, as to the character of a third, is an example of the second class. Cowp. 729; 4 Camp. 152; 1 Rawle, 42; 1 B. & A. 683. Vide lllicit; Unlawful.

ILLEGITIMATE. That which is contrary to law; it is usually applied to children born out of lawful wedlock. A bastard is sometimes called an illegitimate child.


So, is LEGAL the undoing of God's Law? It appears so.

-Howie






Gavilan said Jan 29, 2016
So, is LEGAL the undoing of God's Law? It appears so.

-Howie


Howie,

It's not that I don't agree, I was just trying to verify the quote.

There are so many misquotation, and misleading information out there that you can get caught in a bind if you don't verify something and rely on it.






some_dude said Jan 29, 2016

So, the LEGAL duties with respect to a Citizen within the Kingdom of Heaven would be SUPERIOR to one's duties while on Earth (Romans 13:1-2), thus it is ALL RELATIVE to the nature of the use of that "word" .. it can either be black magic (acceptance of the agreement to a negative status) or white magic (without the negative status) with respect to the WORD.




FYI: GOVERNMENT derives from the words:

the Latin verb Guverno, Guvernare meaning "to control" and the Latin noun "mens", "mentis" meaning "mind"
~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.





AnthonyJoseph said Jan 30, 2016
"GOVERNMENT derives from the words: the Latin verb Guverno, Guvernare meaning "to control" and the Latin noun "mens", "mentis" meaning "mind""

If that is true, that is why the founders created a nation of "self-governance", if you can keep it...




RowanLefwyn said Feb 11, 2016
You probably won't find legal defined for you as opposite of God's law (natural law) in a dictionary or encyclopedia. At least not to precision satisfaction. The folks who are discussing LAW vs LEGAL are of the metaphysical, estoric ilk who get really deep into the structures of language, what it does to the subconscious and other frameworks of social programming through the sounds coming out of our mouths.


When you get away from definitions, its the virtue or meaning--what the word does--that shows Legal is a, not opposite of natural law, but more reversal of natural law--through language or words in certain circumstances. More often than not now. That we should be familiar with. More of an antagonistic force rather that denotes opposites or undoing. You can't un-do nature. It exists regardless of what we say or do.

More a matter of metaphysics, esoteria and social programming through English/Latin & other languages than definitions. It's an non-institutionalized study of social programming, what words do (meaning) vs.(verses!) how they are defined, called trivium/quadrivium. This study eventually leads you down the rabbit hole of language programming, how letters are words, and words are sentences, etc.


Obviously we have some intuitive, abstract subconscious issue with the word Legal for a bunch of reason I won't post unless anyone is curious about it. Definitions are rather useless. We want to look at what the word does. Words do or act in certain respects. That's why they have 'motions' in court. Those are all composed of words.

L-AWE

LEGAL

The weird thing about LEGAL is if you take all the Vow-ELS (oath or agreement making sounds from it) its LGL, forwards and backwards. If you spell it in reverse its essential sound and meaning (what it does) remains the same LAGEL. While its been given a great deal of definition it has little in terms of motion or being, its rather a dead word. It doesn't go anywhere and has only the power that we give it.

EL-power

LE-reverse of power

What is the reverse of power.

Remember we have been taught to think in opposites instead of reversals. Driving a automobile should show us that. Opposition has more to do with Opponents if one wants the word to fit into the context of the subject here. Opposes natural law but only because we empower it to.


If latin meanings in terms of law still hold true, the word law should be portrayed as Lex. Legal, if it had anything to do with natural law would be Lexal, or lex-el, if it was portrayed honestly it would be ELEXEL in an authentic sense.

Unfortunately LEX is more to do with Lexicon (words, speech=programming) than natural law. Lex-ICON.

There is really no word for natural law because natural law is observed not spoken. The 2nd amendment is the best observable and self evident example of that. You can describe natural law, you can enumerate it but can you speak it into existence with any form of word?

EL (L-as a word not a letter) is the best the Hebrews could come up with in terms of the powers of natural law as they are briefly referred to in the Declaration of Independence. El-ohim, El-lectricty. L is one of those strange letters that serves as a letter and a word and has an oathmaking (Vow-el) incorporated (if you excuse the expression) into it.

EL vs LE..

Examine any word with LE --Legal, legitimacy, Legate and be suspicious :)

If legal had anything to do with natural law it would be portrayed as EL instead of LE.

But again natural law is observed and self evident you can't change it with words, define it with words. One can just be brainwashed into believing the written law has more EL--power--than natural which observably it does not.






RowanLefwyn said Feb 11, 2016
Here's a obvious example of natural verses saying.

Illegitimate. That which is contrary to law; it is usually applied to children born out of lawful wedlock. A bastard is sometimes called an illegitimate child.

Legitimate child. Born under a contract (marriage contract), legitimate issue etc.

So ...what? The child doesn't exist just because the legality *says* so?

So a lot of us are bastards because ....our parent's probably had marriage licenses instead of contracts or vows?

None of us exist then, we're all dead? Legally yes. Under natural law, no. Obviously because natural law is observable, legalities are not. Just words, verses, tracts, sayings, spellings.

Maybe that's a part of the dysfunction, we have to back up beyond the certificate of live birth and look at the marriage license that may seemingly prohibits us from our inheritance. We're all bastards. But bastards were ACKNOWLEDGED children of nobility. Or even considered children born in a barn (manger?) ==Bairn--scotch word for baby. Low-birth?

Contrary=contract. Tract-verse--Saying.

Then look at marriage versus wedding versus wedlock (the latter is a rather disturbing word, bringing up visions of balls and chains)

Language is weird stuff....:) It shows more than it tells.





some_dude said Feb 11, 2016
However, since "legal" also appears to be more concerned with "Old Testament" or "Mosiac Law" (law of moses), then it does make sense that under the "law", one does not receive Grace; Grace is "New Testament", thus it is my conclusion that should one walk in faith with the whole of God's Law, then one's works or fruit done in exercise of that faith should fulfill any "legal obligations" and one shall receive GRACE: legally and illegally.

But as far as the quote referenced at the beginning of this article, I am being led to believe "legal" is not the undoing of God's Law, per se, but excessive adherence to law or formula, from what I have witnessed, will result in a form of FUNDAMENTALISM of which appears to lead people down the road of EXTREMEISM of which results in TERRORISM because to be 100% "legal" means STRICT "adherence to the Law rather than to the Gospel, the doctrine of justification by works" of which appears to be a rejection of God in favor of Man as God: Satanism ... Man as JUDGE, JURY, and EXECUTIONER without grace, forgiveness, nor mercy.

So, for now, the LEGAL WAIVER shall remain.




read the full article here
~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.






Gavilan said Feb 11, 2016
But as far as the quote referenced at the beginning of this article, I am being led to believe "legal" is not the undoing of God's Law, per se, but excessive adherence to law or formula, from what I have witnessed, will result in a form of FUNDAMENTALISM of which appears to lead people down the road of EXTREMISM of which results in TERRORISM because to be 100% "legal" means STRICT "adherence to the Law rather than to the Gospel, the doctrine of justification by works" of which appears to be a rejection of God in favor of Man as God: Satanism ... Man as JUDGE, JURY, and EXECUTIONER without grace, forgiveness, nor mercy.

Just like every other religion.

So, for now, the LEGAL WAIVER shall remain.


Luke 11:37-54New International Version (NIV)

Woes on the Pharisees and the Experts in the Law
37 When Jesus had finished speaking, a Pharisee invited him to eat with him; so he went in and reclined at the table. 38 But the Pharisee was surprised when he noticed that Jesus did not first wash before the meal.

39 Then the Lord said to him, “Now then, you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside you are full of greed and wickedness. 40 You foolish people! Did not the one who made the outside make the inside also? 41 But now as for what is inside you—be generous to the poor, and everything will be clean for you.

42 “Woe to you Pharisees, because you give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all other kinds of garden herbs, but you neglect justice and the love of God. You should have practiced the latter without leaving the former undone.

43 “Woe to you Pharisees, because you love the most important seats in the synagogues and respectful greetings in the marketplaces.

44 “Woe to you, because you are like unmarked graves, which people walk over without knowing it.”

45 One of the experts in the law answered him, “Teacher, when you say these things, you insult us also.”

46 Jesus replied, “And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.

47 “Woe to you, because you build tombs for the prophets, and it was your ancestors who killed them. 48 So you testify that you approve of what your ancestors did; they killed the prophets, and you build their tombs. 49 Because of this, God in his wisdom said, ‘I will send them prophets and apostles, some of whom they will kill and others they will persecute.’ 50 Therefore this generation will be held responsible for the blood of all the prophets that has been shed since the beginning of the world, 51 from the blood of Abel to the blood of Zechariah, who was killed between the altar and the sanctuary. Yes, I tell you, this generation will be held responsible for it all.

52 “Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering.”

53 When Jesus went outside, the Pharisees and the teachers of the law began to oppose him fiercely and to besiege him with questions, 54 waiting to catch him in something he might say.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2011:37-54






RowanLefwyn said Feb 12, 2016
Yes. The old testament is testimony to what was occuring, a sort of show of cause and effect. The Torah (old Testament) is clearly stated by the Jews as 'the Written Law'. T-ora(l)You can't write natural law so...the old Testament was an excercize in people trying to lay down the law, right-rite-write the rules --which is why there's chapters of; eat this, don't eat that, sit, stand, take your shoes off, put your shoes on, cloven hoof is okay to eat, but not if they aren't chewing cud. Literally hide bound in rules that really have nothing to do with natural law.

So then comes the ten commandments so all these petty laws could be set aside. Like "forget all this shit, and focus on the 10."

10 are digits, not enumerations because the 10 commandments also were to serve as a binary currency system based on l and 0. Abeyance to the 10 commandments creates a current--energy--a current. That currency of charge and discharge is what "they" are operating on and we are attempting to obey .

Natural law doesn't forbid killing or theft. If it did we'd not have any idea of their existence. However murder, theft, covetry, bearing false witness etc creates dysfunctional societies; it creates debt, usury (the reversal of usufruct) poverty--all the circumstances that break down society into usury, debt, sin instead of making for tranquil ones of usufruct, and prosperity.

Well apparently they still didn't get it. So here comes Jesus with a new covenant. Instead of refraining from murder, theft, covetry, and graven images lets try peace, love, charity. Different causes same effect .

But we still didn't get it. Plus the currency issue was entirely overlooked and changed back into money (money changing.)

I look at the account of what was posted above and that could be today. How many times have you posted something publically and you have a mob of people not waiting to 'see' or comprehend what you are showing, but waiting for you to make a typo to use as an excuse to dis-invalidate everything you are attempting to convey? "waiting to catch him in something he might say". Same in a court room. What we see in court is merely a reflection of what goes on in public.


But sometime in the last 6 years since 2010 or so we started getting it.

Or people just get offended.

"One of the experts in the law answered him, “Teacher, when you say these things, you insult us also.”
Unread replies start below for topic 'Unable to confirm quote: "legal: the undoing of God's Law"'.





SueMaynes said Mar 05, 2016
From the 1828.mshaffer.com

Law:LAW, n. [L.]

1. A rule, particularly an established or permanent rule, prescribed by the supreme power of a state to its subjects, for regulating their actions, particularly their social actions. Laws are imperative or mandatory, commanding what shall be done; prohibitory, restraining from what is to be forborn; or permissive, declaring what may be done without incurring a penalty. The laws which enjoin the duties of piety and morality, are prescribed by God and found in the Scriptures.
Law is beneficence acting by rule.

LE'GAL, a. [L.]

1. According to law; in conformity with law; as a legal standard or test; a legal procedure.
2. Lawful; permitted by law; as a legal trade. Anything is legal which the laws do not forbid.


The key expression for me is that legals are "in conformity with law." That places legals as the copy-cats.





some_dude said Mar 05, 2016
forgot about this definition:

According to the law of works, as distinguished from free grace; or resting on works for salvation.


Grace is divine, but the law does not rest on grace, it rests on works for salvation ... legal is to judge and through this, the knowledge of good and evil is known.



"Romans 3:20 - because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin."


~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.





SueMaynes said Mar 05, 2016
So obedience to the request not to eat from the tree was to remain in Law.
Eating from the tree brought in the knowledge of the choice, the danger in that choice and the resulting necessity for legal control.

Law is self-control.
Legal is external control.




some_dude said Mar 06, 2016
exactly ... legal is knowledge of good and evil (judgment)


either govern yourself from within or you will surely be governed from without
~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.



~ Boris

We are called to be architects of the future, not its victims;
Resistance is futile.

If you think you can, you are correct.
If you think you can't, you are correct.